>>25786 Is it too much to ask for a decent live action Freeze or will hollywood inevitably fuck it up because good luck finding writers who can depict his love for Nora and how far he'll go for her while still portraying him in a somewhat tragic light?

>>25787 Depends how much harder Matt Reeves wants to go for the "realistic" re-imagining angle. Riddler was turned into a Zodiac Killer "dark web" chan incel who did none of the physical dirty work himself. While Joker is now a deformed guy with patches of green hair aping off of Heath Ledger's stupid smacking take. Robert Pattinson is more than willing to do campy villains in the sequel. I don't know if they could do a good Freeze.

>>25788 >>25787 I think the reason they stay away from Freeze is because 1. Batman & Robin is still in public memory, so people will still think about Arnie making ice puns and having his goons sing Snow Miser. 2. Heart of Ice is the most remembered episode of B:tAS, hell, it even won an Emmy, but for that reason people constantly feel the need to redo it, leading to Freeze getting the reputation of being a one trick pony storywise with "Muh wife" being the only thing people remember about him. So they try to shake it up, be it darker and grittier Batman series making him into some incel stalker with Nora not even knowing who he is, to that one time they brought Nora back with a Lazarus pit and she actually resented being kept alive (and then also turned into a villain with fire powers, because irony.)

>>25789 Yeah the internet pop culture bias is too prevalent in the mind of casual normalfags.

>>25789 >>25790 Tell that to Gotham.

>>25831 You act like Gotham is good. When it's not. None of the villains should even be active.

>>25839 Because they'd all be in their forties by the time Batman even appeared. Besides, the only thing I remember about Gotham is Tumblrettes latching on to twink Penguin for a hot minute before going back to schlicking themselves to Dr. Who and Supernatural.

>>25841 Most of Batman's villains are 30 to 40 though. Joker isn't a young guy. Freeze is only preserved by his cryo condition. Point is you shouldn't have a batman show without Batman. Arrow did the same thing instead of making an actual Green Arrow show.

>>25781 >Are you fucking kidding me? No anon, it's true, batman was campy and over the top only in the Adam west or brave and the bold. The rest of the times he always was quasi realistic, even in the early 1940 stories

>>25842 What they could do is have this five season series on Batman's early years, focused on the GCPD >Season 1 is where shit's utterly hopeless for the GCPD, focused on building up the crime families and gangleaders/super villains >Season 2 is when Gordon joins the force(or gets promoted or what have you), things are still shit in the GCPD and he's getting stonewalled at every turn but ultimately he's slowly making a change for the better. Ends at teasting Batman. >Season 3 is where Gordon's finally able to do enough work to dismantle one of the bigger crime families, both due to his work and unwittingly due to Batman's work in the background. Season ends with Gordon and the GCPD getting rid of that crime family and a good chunk of corruption in the GCPD, but learning of Batman's existence. >Season 4 is the GCPD is at it's lowest where while it's no longer as corrupt, the honest cops are utterly demoralized by the fact that one vigilante is doing the heavy lifting and how Gotham's lost hope in the GCPD. Gordon's trying to arrest Batman to show that vigilantes are shit, while Batman's still convinced the GCPD's still completely corrupt and cannot be trusted. Meanwhile a crime element(Not the fucking joker) is gathering strength in the background >Season 5 is where said crime element steps out of the shadows and is too much for early years Batman or the still newly reformed and demoralized GCPD to handle individually. First half of the season is the individual attempts by either party to dismantle that criminal organization to not much effect, third quarter of the season is either Batman reaching out to Gordon or the other way around to start an alliance and the final quarter of the series is the GCPD and Batman is working together to dismantle the organization. Maybe the final shot of the series is the installation of the bat signal or something solidifying the alliance between Batman and GCPD Of course it's all a pipe dream that hinges on the idea that there would be a writer good enough to depict the above well, in which case you might as well say any show or movie can work fine with good enough writing, production, acting, etc.

>>25848 There is almost 20 years between Detective 27 and Adam West Batman. Batman was very goofy for a long time before that show. The whole 1950s, for example. However, during the run of the show, the comics switched to the "New Look" era with the yellow oval symbol, which also introduced a more serious era to the stories.

>>24239 All bats are potentially infected with rabbies and other unknown diseases. A bat is as scary as a rat because just a bite can ruin your life.

>>25783 >play up the rich boy persona DCSHG really nailed it, they even have reality show called "Make It Wayne" starring Bruce and Alfred, kek. I would watch it if they make it an actual show. As for live action movie, I'd like to imagine scene where Bruce socializing with fellow high class and then near the end when it's also shown that he is coming back to his lonely mansion, "There Is a Light That Never Goes Out" is being played in the background. >>25785 >>25786 >>25787 My bet next movie will Have Joker and Harley Quinn. I do wonder what other villains would be...I'd love to see Copperhead being mostly human again instead of the generic boring reptilian monster they turned him into, I don't really care for 3DPD movies, but that way it would impact other media like comics and cartoons. >>25788 >Depends how much harder Matt Reeves wants to go for the "realistic" re-imagining angle He doesn't have a lot of "realistic" villains to choose from, unless I'm wrong, in which case he will have to use character with superpower of more fantastic ones as Mr.Freeze. >>25789 >but for that reason people constantly feel the need to redo it They already did it in TNBA; after Freeze got his happy ending in the "Batman & Mr. Freeze: SubZero", they just had to turn him into miserable piece of shit like Bruce. >Freeze getting the reputation of being a one trick pony storywise with "Muh wife" being the only thing people remember about him How is it any different than Batman "Muh parents"? I don't see anything wrong with giving an ending to story (in fact I support it). Logically a character would cease to do certain thing when the motivation to it is no longer exists and been resolved. Just let Mr. Freeze have his happy ending, dammit! >making him into some incel stalker with Nora not even knowing who he is, to that one time they brought Nora back with a Lazarus pit and she actually resented being kept alive (and then also turned into a villain with fire powers, because irony.) Is that going to be in the upcoming "Caped Crusader" cartoon? I can't wait to witness the absolute trainwreck it's going to be (Matt Reeves is also involved in it). >>25848 >The rest of the times he always was quasi realistic, even in the early 1940 stories Anon we have already gone through this...Batman in the original comic was a psychopath and the world setting didn't make any sense. Besides the usual "muh parents" and "muh morals" which is what Batman' poorly written personality consisted of, he is often ridiculously plotarmored and wanked, hence there's nothing realistic about him. As you can see above John K put Batman in the fantastic characters, in contrast to say Spiderman who is a combination of fantastic and observed/realistic character; Spiderman, aka Peter Parker is a round character with struggles, aspirations and feelings that goes beyond his superhero persona and his crimefighting. When you think about Spiderman, you think about Peter whereas when you think about Batman you rarely, if even think about Bruce, because Bruce doesn't have actual character with depth, and therefore so does Batman lacks character. >>25842 >Point is you shouldn't have a batman show without Batman The real problem (besides the live action) is there wasn't another superhero to substitute him. Batman is a shitty character in a cool setting, without his rouge gallery Batman is nothing. In other words, Batman' villains could work with other superheros, but Batman couldn't. For example, I love how Catwoman and Poison Ivy were handled in DCSHG, they're finally given characters beyond being Batman' hoes.

>>25897 Maybe now they can have a scene where it's like Bruce refurbished his old family mansion & is using it to host a charity event for Gotham's rich to fix the city. Having to now play up a public figure persona but retreating into the dark privacy of his study when it becomes too much for him to keep up. Showing a continued progression of having to be more than just a vigilante. They've already set up Joker, Penguin, Hush, & Riddler returning. Though Hush would be pretty different considering he has no family fortune like the Wayne's. Though he's relatively low tech as a villain & could've made his money as a surgeon anyway. Sick to death of Joker & I don't like the new design they've given him so I can't say I'm looking forward to him. Penguin could work as maybe a background villain rising up in the underworld rather than a main villain. As far as standard "realistic" villains go there's Two Face being just a guy with a split personality & scarred face. Baby Doll isn't completely unbelievable but you'd have to have a specific kind of actress that could pull off looking like a little girl. Killer Croc you'd have to exaggerate since his skin condition is fantasy levels of transformation. He'd be more of a thug than a main villain. You can do villains like Scarecrow, Firefly, Killer Moth, & hell even Bane can be done grounded enough. It's all scifi tech & drugs but you can make it believable enough for an audience. The obsession with realism destroys imagination rather than enhancing it. Most if not all comic book characters are shitty characters. They're stuck in settings with consistency, permanence, or progression. It's just the same loop of fighting the same villains over & over without an end in sight. That's why most people prefer those good cartoon show & movie adaptations that condense it all down into a real universe. That's why The Animated Series is so beloved. Even Beyond is well received & does new things rather than just future versions of the same villains all the time.

>>25897 >Just let Mr. Freeze have his happy ending, dammit! Didn't that happen with B&R, where Batman agreed to help Freeze with saving his wife as well as get revenge on Ivy? >whereas when you think about Batman you rarely, if even think about Bruce, because Bruce doesn't have actual character with depth, and therefore so does Batman lacks character. That's actually more of a recent issue because of how you have these idiot writers at companies who are focussed more upon creating story about "Batman" than stories that are about Bruce Wayne disguised as Batman. In fact, it's part of the reason why you keep seeing them replace legacy characters with diversity hires because all they see is a costume, NOT the person under the costume. One show that made me realize this was the Iron Man anime where, despite what happens in the comics, the other TV shows, and the later films, Tony Stark is the ONLY character who ever dawns the Iron Man suit because he is Iron Man. He and the character are in seperable. This was also apparent in earlier adaptations of superhero shows like the live-action The Adventures of Superman from the 50's where most of the episode deals very little with Supes, himself, and he only changes his costume towards the end of the episode when he has no other choice. So, what you end up with is a series about Clark Kent who becomes the hero that is Superman. And, until we actually get writers who realize this, all we'll endlessly get is everyone dressing up as Batman, and no one understanding why people even like Batman.

>>25897 Every character is plot armored in their story anon, stop pretending that batman is more OP then any another. By your logic Peter has the same character problem with "muh uncle ben" and "I'm broke" or the worst of all "poor aunt may" so what you are saying is that YOU and John Kricfalusi think batman is specifically bad just cause of no money problem batman have some character, it struggles with any human connection even with his putative father and its clear especially in stories when he needs to be a father for any robinfuck it was one of the main point of brake between bruce and Dick, he has the aspiration to clean the city from evildoers or at least make a change in it. Stop pretending he is a 2d thin character just cause someone dressed as a bat fiddle your diddle years ago, it's not tbe best character but it is a character. Sucks to have comics from before ww2 around, same could be said for superman or wonder woman Fuck if we really want to be autistic about it this litterally who John k admitted that spiderman created the problem of infiltrating actual current year problems in comics such as aids in the hulk and racism in spiderman exactly cause it left the cliche plus you really are retarded too, the realism im talking about goes in the fact that batman uses gadgets that might exist in real life, against campy Adam west or BADB one. But your hatebatboner clearly brings tmyour autismo to 11

>>25897 I'm curious, how do you feel about the Copperhead in Arkham Origins? Also I'm sorry, what's DCSHG an acronym for?

DCAU Freeze's episode and ending in Batman Beyond was good, so I don't mind Freeze's appearances after Heart of Ice, even if they aren't as good.

>>25902 >what's DCSHG an acronym for? DC Super Hero Girls, I'm assuming.

>>25898 Don't forget that some of the goofy minor villains usually get the "gritty and realistic" treatment, like Calendar Man being re-imagined as a holiday themed serial killer instead of just a criminal with holiday motifs. Same thing could happen to a bunch of minor villains, like Clock King being re-imagined as a mad bomber with OCD so kind of like a grittier version of the DCAU Clock King

>>25917 >like Clock King being re-imagined as a mad bomber with OCD I was imagining them turning him into Saw, since all of his traps are extremely autistic and limiting of what the victims can do down to a time table.

>>25921 But the puppet thing is Scarface's shtick.

>>25922 I'm not talking about the puppet, I was referring to the traps that Saw creates and his autistic attention to detail "solving" the trap. I just used the puppet as a way to point out which Saw I was referring.

>>25923 Honestly that's what Riddler should've been like. Even the Telltale Batman games got that right. Current incel Riddler should've been Anarky. Even works with the fake Riddler thugs doing the heavy lifting by already having a mask.

>>25898 >Maybe now they can have a scene where it's like Bruce refurbished his old family mansion & is using it to host a charity event for Gotham's rich to fix the city. Having to now play up a public figure persona but retreating into the dark privacy of his study when it becomes too much for him to keep up >Showing a continued progression of having to be more than just a vigilante Yes, but the example you gave is still about him helping people, I'd like to see a focus on Bruce' personal aspirations or struggles. >Two Face Oh I completely forgot about him, I am not fan of his schtick and he doesn't have any special or interesting abilities, just a distorted look. Also, he appeared in the Nolan trilogy so I doubt that they will be inclined to use him again. >Baby Doll isn't completely unbelievable but you'd have to have a specific kind of actress that could pull off looking like a little girl No chance they will use her in live action film much like avoiding young Robin in live action. >Killer Croc you'd have to exaggerate since his skin condition is fantasy levels of transformation. He'd be more of a thug than a main villain That would be boring, he should've elongated jaw like a crocodile. >Scarecrow, Firefly, Killer Moth That's also optional. >Bane can be done grounded enough They already did it the Nolan trilogy so it's unlikely they will use him. >Most if not all comic book characters are shitty characters. They're stuck in settings with consistency, permanence, or progression. It's just the same loop of fighting the same villains over & over without an end in sight. That mostly true to big two duopoly, especially when they started to pander to nerds instead of targeting kids. Golden age comics had far greater creativity (thanks to the greater amount of companies and parasitically no censorship) when each issue/story had new villain so it's felt more like an adventure story and it's more exciting because you don't what will happen next. Also as John K mentioned, the attempt of making superheroes more realistic in 60's Marvel comic was innovative and made the stories a lot more compelling. I don't think it's fair to denounce the comic book genre, just because, like in every genre, the majority of it is full of crap. > That's why most people prefer those good cartoon show & movie adaptations that condense it all down into a real universe No, that' because they're casualfags and in the case of live action only, normalfags. >That's why The Animated Series is so beloved BTAS truly deserve its high acclaim, it was well animated and written. IMO Bruce was still somewhat bland (the drama never really involved him and there was little focus on him just as being Bruce), I think they tried to fix it in the "Batman: Mask of the Phantasm" but didn't really succeed. >Even Beyond is well received & does new things rather than just future versions of the same villains all the time Inque is the best femme fatale, extremely dangerous and deadly and as equally sexy, she and Curare are best girls. Stalker is also awesome. Shriek has cool powers and the episodes with him were always great, though his personality is kinda boring. Spellbinder doesn't lead to cool fights and his origin story is really lame, but when his abilities are used well it can lead to interesting stories. Blight is neat, but never reach his full potential. I honestly wish BB was dead and forgotten,everything past the original series which itself declined, dumb ROTJ and issue 14 comic is complete garbage I just read the new shitty BB comics, kill me . >>25899 >B&R What?! I have no idea what you're talking and what is this acronym stands for. >Batman agreed to help Freeze with saving his wife as well as get revenge on Ivy Sound cool, I'd like to see/read it. >That's actually more of a recent issue With Batman? I highly doubt it. >it's part of the reason why you keep seeing them replace legacy characters with diversity hires because all they see is a costume, NOT the person under the costume The main reason is lazy woke cashgrab. Also, they're incapable of creating new things which is a waste of money anyway since they will have to invest in branding ,etc when they're already have plethora of copyrighted characters...IP laws were a mistake. >And, until we actually get writers who realize this There are two base elements which either creates a good story and together creates an excellent story: 1. Interesting and logical sequence of events 2. Good human drama. Today's writers are complete hacks and fail at both. >no one understanding why people even like Batman. Because people either saw him in a movie or a cartoon as kids and thought he was cool? Most people don't share our deep obsession for fictional characters from children' media. The attempt to popularize nerd culture didn't success well, most people would still not bother to read comics and if they buy merch it would usually be just cheap stuff like a t-shirt and god forbid Funko Pop which they stumble upon, like they wouldn't go out of their way and seek it.

>>25900 >Every character is plot armored in their story anon, Nope, not on Batman level where he is supposedly a mere human being without special powers or even heavy armor, yet he can handle Darkseid who is a god! Batman should stay in godforsaken Gotham and leave the Justice League, all he does is making characters around him job. >batman is more OP then any another He is >By your logic Peter has the same character problem with "muh uncle ben" and "I'm broke" or the worst of all "poor aunt may" I'm currently reading the original Spiderman comic and this flanderzation is far from the truth. Unlike say in the animated where "uncle Ben died so I must become a capeshitter", Peter didn't became immediately a superhero afterwards and it wasn't even what motivated him to do so, in fact he still tried to make money from his Spiderman gig (especially after he and aunt May become poor due to uncle Ben' death) but turned he couldn't. Seeing he has nothing better to do, he came to a big event which happened to give him the opportunity to save a life and use his powers for good (heck I already wrote about it earlier in the thread). The "I'm broke" was resolved fairly quickly when Peter was hired to work as photographer in Daily Bugle and isn't mentioned often, and as for "poor aunt may" I only witnessed it twice out of the 12 issues I read so far. Spiderman is the opposite of Batman, he is a good character in a lame setting - New York is nowhere near as interesting as fictional Gotham, his villains are lame and have retarded origin stories. I'm not even particularly fond of his superpowers or costume, I'm just rooting for Peter because he is such a compelling and well written character and this is why I continue to read his comic, unlike the original Batman comic which is absolute dogshit. I think it's better to have a (good) character carrying the story rather than the story carrying the (bad) character. >batman have some character Kek, an insufferable asshole at best. >it struggles with any human connection even with his putative father and its clear especially in stories when he needs to be a father for any robinfuck it was one of the main point of brake between bruce and Dick And yet the Gary Stu never face the consequences for his actions. So he was a complete asshole and drove everyone off? Well, lucky for him crazy Waller decided to cuck some innocent man (who is married and both he and his wife shares nearly identical psychological profiles to those of Bruce's parents) and created a clone son for him which of course she did in the name of her admiration for Bruce' sense of Justice and she almost killed that innocent man and his wife, truly prove what an upstanding person Bruce is:^) >he has the aspiration to clean the city from evildoers or at least make a change in it That's just him being Batman again, that's not a personal. Come on, that's the aspiration that every superhero has, it doesn't define him as individual character. >he is a 2d thin character He is, batwanker in denial. >cause someone dressed as a bat Terry being well written (besides being a shit boyfriend) has nothing to do with Bruce being poorly written, in contrast, and the reason why Batman is a poor flat character. Here is the thing, it's not about Batman being Terry, but Terry being Batman and that's exactly what I also meant about Spiderman. It's not the costume, but the person behind it and again in the case of Batman the person behind it is a shallow boring character that mostly relies on its interesting world setting. >litterally who John k >the batwanker doesn't acknowledge John K being a great (former) animator >John k admitted that spiderman created the problem of infiltrating actual current year problems in comics such as aids in the hulk and racism in spiderman exactly cause it left the cliche It wasn't specifically Spiderman, but the whole 60's Marvel. He also mentioned that this approach gave a breath of fresh air to comics. You also need to take to consideration that starting from the 70's and forwards comic began to pander to nerds and stopped targeting kids. If you want to go back full Golden Age, Batman still sucks, even back then. >you really are retarded too I'm not the batwanker:^) > the realism im talking about goes in the fact that batman uses gadgets that might exist in real life, against campy Adam west or BADB one >autismo Not caring for human interactions and instead only caring for technical stuff, is the sigh of autism and also you clearly talked about his character rather than the setting which seems you keep confusing with, dumbass batwanker. >>25902 >I'm curious, how do you feel about the Copperhead in Arkham Origins? I hate it, it's vaginawashing and generic hoe outfit. Cooperhead should keep his snake-like costume with the snake' head and tail and have fangs and reptilian pupils. > Also I'm sorry, what's DCSHG an acronym for? What >>25913 said. >>25903 I sorta agree, I mean the BB episode was good and but it relied on a bad episode from TNBA. So it's a weird situation in which the BB episode make sense, but not the TNBA one which it is following.

>>25950 Are you that one ESL who kvetched in the Justice League unlimited thread?

>>25950 >I hate it, it's vaginawashing and generic hoe outfit. That hoe definitely does not wash its vagina.

>>25950 >he never face the consequences of his actions <it's left yet again alone reaching a level that even superman has to go tell him to chill from beating the thugs to hard You do realize that traumatized people would behave that way right? They will not get close to anyone and will push who's close away >all that Terry stuff Who are you quoting? Do you even read before posting? I never even went on talking about Terry. >that's just hum being batman <clearly does a fuckload of stuff as philanthropist and helper with his Bruce way persona >he is batwanker in denial He is not bathater >doesn't acknowledge John k as being a great animator he did some hanna and Barbara stuff little tom and jerry, and most famous for Ren and Stimpy. Again litterally who? >Not caring for human interactions and instead only caring for technical stuff, is the sigh of autism and also you clearly talked about his character rather than the setting which seems you keep confusing with Are you a single digit nigger? I've immediately started talking about his gadget and then since you moved the goal post to his character i had to point out the BS you were on about Oh i get it anon, so someone dressed as a bat really did fiddle your diddle when you were young. Otherwise it's unexplainable this hate bones you have against him.

>>25949 But anon, helping people is Bruce's personal aspiration.

>>25988 >on /co/ and pretends Ren & Stimpy and John K aren't great That guy you're arguing with is a retard, but this makes you even more retarded than him.

>>25998 >grotesque style lolsorandum humor >molester animator up his own ass >great C'mon now.

>>25998 Anon, it might have been ok at best, just like grim adventure of Billy and Mandy or cow and chicken for the lolrabdom humor... he did maybe a good job with jettsons, but now elevate his opinion as Bible state on any character is bullshit on the ^n level

>>26009 Is there any thread to talk about Dr Strange and how shitty the movie is?

>>26015 There's some discussion in the pain thread but your free to make a thread for it.

>>26009 Those other shows have fucking shit animation compared to Ren & Stimpy, and the later ones wouldnt exist without it in the first place.