>>8666 Looking forward to this. On language, most Indians have good enough English but bad thinking and thought formation. You talk to them in any language, even their mother tongue and their thoughts are ill formed, vague and never to the point. People with precise thinking can manage with limited vocab and not sound like a retard.

>>8668 mitra, now i have started chatting with people n broken slang. suggest me some book

>>8668 Indians are terrible at understanding context or sarcasm, which are far more difficult to teach. Leads to many unfortunate instances. I hope mudiji bans the internet.

>>8666 Only one solution: lurk moar. >After all, how else would anyone know I'm an indian unless I type like one If your intention is to hide your indianness, find better things to do and stop hiding behind flags and good grammar. People worth talking to are not going to scrutinize your posts to find out if you are Indian. Doesn't mean you should not use good grammar and vocab - people are going to judge you by it. I find your motivation to be flawed. >>8668 I have a theory that this results from writing skills from back in school. Not always but often you get marks from disposing ink across the paper in good handwriting, not the quality of your work, Or maybe it's the effect rather than the cause. Who knows.

>>8675 My intention is not to hide my indianness, otherwise one can simply parrot nigga nigga lean gang fr fine type shiit lingo to mimic zoomers. Same could be said for other esl like the hispanics or ruskies here. Its only for good vocab, grammar and responses. >>8669 >>8671 >>8675 >>8668 It does start from school but I somewhat agree that bad thought formation, jumbled vague thoughts does translate into poor sentences even in our native languages. Our spoken speech is often casual, broken, inference-based which translates into vague, broken written speech. You can easily see the difference between a casual hindi text and a formal hindi text. And it gets worsened when that casual speaker tries to directly translate his words into english. We get shit like "Main abhi busy hoon, bahut kaam hai, phir baad mein baat karenge" literally translate into "Right now Im busy, here too much work here, talk later again" because he's transliterating each word into english, one word at a time.

On that note - Rule 0) Nobody cares This is not exclusive to indians, or browsing the internet, but its definitely the most important point everyone should learn as basic education. Nobody cares that you're an indian, or have bad english, or are black, a girl, or a sentient cockroach. All that matters is the content of your posts. You don't need to have the best english to talk to others, you just need to be good enough to get your points across. You don't need to respond when someone points finger at you or the way you type or sound, only reply when they respond about the points you're putting forth. Nobody cares about your personality online and neither should you. Don't let your poor english get in way of interacting with other people online or offline. Its the way you get practice for speaking better. Sure people will make fun of you, call you esl or nigger whatever, but as long as you get your point across who cares? Just say "sory for my bed england" or something, its not like they're gonna refute your points anyway. And if they do say something about your point, focus on that. Talk more about the specific point rather than focusing on their negative comments. Someone else might engage you about your content rather than calling out negatives, so keep your focus on that. I see this way too often in video game chat when any indian guy says something and others jump in saying shut up indian, and guy gets into argument, getting defensive on his identity, and then back and forth chimp out ensues and it ruins the whole game's experience. Ignore. You don't have to reply anything. Focus on callouts, focus on enemy positions, others care about these important things more than your bad accent. Stop caring about those "dirty indian" comments, keep your focus on the game and don't feed them more. If they aren't calling out enemy's location they aren't important, so make yourself important by talking about it. Conversely, don't put on a fake accent, or fake a personality. Please don't. The cringiest thing anyone can do is fake a persona for themselves. Don't act as a white urban american just talking american politics, some cool urban hip lingo. Don't too much emphasis on yourself, nobody cares. If you're talking about american politics there is no need to fake being an american. Focus on what you actually do rather than faking a "presentable version of yourself".

>>8679 I wanted to put this point first before all other points to emphasize that yes, its good to have proper english but its shouldn't be your limiting factor for interacting online. Its to ease your worries about whether I'm speaking the correct english or if I'm pronouncing words right, all those kinds of worries. Life becomes easier when you don't take yourself seriously. Same with talking online, you're just talking to random nigas over electricity

>>8679 > Don't put a fake persona How do you know? The guy or gay might actually be that cringy irl.

>>8675 I agree with your theory. But there is another adjacent observation Indians don't drive, they respond to the traffic in real time. Indians also speak like that There is no goal, the purpose is to speak. Words are used without knowing the meaning, comments are made that have vague emotional indication but nothing else. Example of a convo between two rich zoomers > Person 1 - My dad got ABC expensive car, he had to 123456 Rs. It was expensive > Person 2 - Fucking Nirmala Tai. She doesn't know economics etc > Person 1 - Yeah, fuck Capitalism bro. I actually stopped and asked Person 1, what is Capitalism ? He genuinely did not know. He basically said "cool lagta hai sir". He is talking about his dad buying a german car, the issue is extra tax's on this luxury item. And his problem is Capitalism. Sadly even Indians with decent education talk like this >>8669 What language ? I choose classics to clean my pallet. For Indian languages, translations of Ramayana or Sanskrit plays. For English , Illiad or something like Monte Cristo etc.

>>8679 Full agreement. You could have worded it better so people get your point better, but agree with each and every point.

>>8666 Forgot to write yesterday (although to lurk moar kind of implies this) is to read as much as you can. Read books, articles, blogs, stories, journals, papers, posts, comments about things you like, and about things you don't like, occasionally. The things you read should be written by reputable people at least until you can tell junk/lies apart from true information. It's better if you read things written by people from different countries, not just focusing on one. Do you know why it is hard to take it seriously when some piece of information seems to have bad grammar/vocab/spellings? Because it is an indication that the author has not done a good amount of reading on the subject, or any subject. If I see you spell it "bumber" instead of bumper on your post about some automobile safety things, I'm going to drop it instantly, true story. Makes it clear the author has absolutely no idea what he's talking about. (Valid for India because we are good sepoys who do all our study and business in English. Exceptions are developed non english speaking countries like Japan, Korea, Nordics etc. and these people likely do have someone proofread their papers before they publish them) >>8696 Agree with the respond thing, but not completely. This is the case almost every time you talk about something technical. When people have clear motives and intentions, their speech is clear and with purpose. When not it usually comes out as a random string that a word prediction engine might spit out. It's dangerous to disregard all speech by assuming it is the latter.

>>8699 The proof reading in non English countries is quiet strict , but we do miss things sometimes. Mainly due to differences in American and British English being annoying. This thread is for people who don't express themselves well, imagine 95% of Bharatchan threads, that talk like a JEE fag who hasn't slept and has sniffed too many lines of complan. People who have clear intent and motives, usually are able to avoid this. True they make make mistakes sometimes and therefore, it is wrong to generalize, but over a long enough time frame, you can sort the retards from the ones worth talking to. The issue is, retards too make good points sometimes. Sometimes it is just by mistake, other times even the slowest one have somethings really right.

I am sorry, I know this post (>>8713) comes off as arrogant , but as >>8699 said If someone has not spent the time to refine his or her ideas,intent,motives in a clear way, I have no need to take them seriously.

You can drastically improve your english by typing like a german who barely knows english - short, to the point, and with a commanding tone. It might not be the best way to convey your thoughts but its effective.

>>8713 >sniffed too many lines of complan LMAO

>>8696 Oh yes, this speech pattern is everywhere, even middle-aged uncles are copying words they see on the internet and add into their sentences, whether they know the meaning or not. Or if its even necessary to add in or not. Just because it "sounds cool and hip". I call it the reddit-tardation of vocabulary, where people ape popular buzzwords in order to sound cool and mimic the popular scene of internet. They have no opinion about capitalism or if it even fits in the discussion, just blurt it out to boost your "coolness". Like video related, they have no opinion or original swing on the topic, just mimic popular culture and be in-culture.

>>8755 Sounds like you are gaslighting us, you narcissist.

>>8755 Sadly this is not new. Boomers used to do it with music or news, especially BBC. Doesn't matter how dumb it was, they would repeat it. Sadly our elites also speak like this. I have thoughts on this topic, but will wait for OP to make more posts and not derail the thread.

I wanted to share something before I post my next tip. Its something I see everyday - people are trying (and failing) to articulate what they're thinking by directly converting hindi and regional languages speech into english. Those two have completely different sentence structures and do not translate well. A few posts I screenshotted from the comments QnA of a video - The first post is good enough, he put his points in, point-wise. Good for QnA. Simple, serviceable and understandable. The 2nd post is the kind Im seeing many times at both work and online. The person is trying to convert his hindi sentences directly into english and it appears as a jumbled up mess. You'd have to put effort to find out what the speaker is trying to say >"Haha concerns it is" is actually "Haan thoda bahut concerns toh hai". >"I really don't understand why kylaq, n if kylaq y kushaq 1 ltr" is actually "Mujhe yeh samajh nhi aa rha, ki agar Kylaq hai, toh Kushaq 1 ltr kyun hai? Iska kya alag kaam hai?" >"May be novice on the topic, but balance thik nhi hai" is "Mujhe iss topic pe zyada nhi pata, par dono cars ke beech mein balance nhi hai" The uncle trying to translate his hindi words into english which doesn't work, and results in this mess. The 3rd post is alright. He could maybe smoothen it as "Is this just a Polo with a different body kit? Im asking as someone who missed out on buying a Polo when it was available" Writing your thoughts separate points works well. And then you can form sentences around it.

>>8852 >>8679 Okay here's the next tip, or rule whatever - Write in points first, then form sentences, then edit them out This is a quick and easy way to convey your topics without it looking like a pile of jumbled shit. Your points are the meat of your speech, join them together forming sentences, have a somewhat coherent flow, then edit your sentences so it fits and fulfills your scenario. Editing is mostly removing the fat and making it compact, the way you place sentences, how you direct those points. Such as you put the leading points first, and then put on what it leads to. You can't directly copypaste hindi and regional words into english, it'll look like an uncle writing email for diwali. For example, heres a typical uncle-speak you'd hear in office - >You're saying that the product marketing is all wrong, it doesn't show our core strengths. So why don't we scrap whole thing? Redo from the beginning and focus on the visual design part. We don't need cheap and affordable part in our marketing. Here, the speaker is talking about 2 things - 1. The speaker hears from someone that the current marketing material is not good, it doesn't show product's strength 2. The speaker suggests to scrap the entire material and start fresh with focus their strengths instead of showing how cheap and affordable their product is These are the major points the speaker wants to put out. A better way to frame the same thing into coherent sentences is - "If what you're saying is true about our product's marketing, then wouldn't it be better if we scratch the entire marketing material and start anew? Focus on our unique visual design rather than how cheap and affordable it is?" This way you did - 1. Acknowledge what the other person is saying first 2. Give your solution/your point based on previous statement 3. Give supporting points to your main point to strengthen your position 4. Framed your point as a 1 line definite, meaningful solution to the situation. A simple, 2 line answer for those 2 points you're making. You can add any number of colorful thesaurus words in them to make you look smart. I know I'm overanalyzing words but this is just an example of what I see everyday, words being as a stream of thoughts, no coherence, you'd have to put effort to find what the speaker is trying to say, and then formulate a resolving reply to them.

>>8767 Oh please, do talk about it. This is a very wide topic thread you aren't derailing it with your thoughts.

## Tangential The problem with Indians using Indianized english in an incoherent way has its origins from the schooling system. It is the way grammar is taught. You aren't supposed to rote learn all the grammar rules of a language and use it as a sort of algorithm while writing or speaking in that language. >why? Because there are too many exceptions in those rules. The rules of grammar aren't concrete. Whenever new writers popularize a new writing style the rules get changed. Albeit they don't change them right away and it takes decades to change them but the problem is that they do change. An ESL stands out because they try to use those proper grammatical rules taught to him when no one whose native language is english talks like that. They always use a variation of their native dialect while writing and often violate the so called rules. This rule pushing technique is more horrible for a vernacular medium student because the teachers are on the top end of the retarded spectrum in government schools. The nigger teachers teaching english hardly let anyone be creative (ironically enough they do the same thing in "creative writing classes). The solution I found was to write whatever I wanted, however I wanted. At first it came off as retarded and gibberish but over the time by simply consooming audiobooks and english goyslop, I was able to build upon the writing style. While those who were stuck with the teacher dictating rules about writing (not grammar) that they made up, were still writing like a chat bot but worse. Yes you are and might always unknowingly flout grammatical rules, maybe misuse certain words in the wrong context and sometimes write incoherent sentences but by getting rid of the fear that your teacher is going to humiliate you in front of the class because you broke xyz section 2 rule of the oxford dictionary just because she was feeling irritated that day because she had a fight with her husband. You improve by simply writing more without giving a shit if anyone calls you an ESL or retarded. For formal stuff, simply use some grammar checking website or use GPT instead. The thing is when you are writing something that you are thinking of in real time, you will have to sacrifice your writing style at first. You can choose to go back and review it or simply ignore it and post it as it is

>>8671 >Indians are terrible at understanding context or sarcasm kek, it's an iq problem >>8696 > what is Capitalism ? >He genuinely did not know that's a midwit problem not an Indian problem. They know that in order to appear smart all they need to do is copy paste jargons.

>>8857 >. The rules of grammar aren't concrete. Whenever new writers popularize a new writing style the rules get changed. Albeit they don't change them right away and it takes decades to change them but the problem is that they do change. This tbh, apparently when radio became mainstream, it killed off a lot of regional accents in western countries. Languages develop and change naturally as soyciety progresses, not bound by the very rigid rules that school education tends to impose upon it, so there is no point in obsessing over them outside of school books. >chatbot Kek Something like the Chinese room maybe. Not exactly, but if the person you are talking to is still abiding by some rules someone else taught him, are you really talking to him? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_room >You improve by simply writing more without giving a shit if anyone calls you an ESL or retarded. Yes but you need some self evaluation and the will to change (sure people in this thread have the but I'm just saying) >The thing is when you are writing something that you are thinking of in real time, you will have to sacrifice your writing style at first. You can choose to go back and review it or simply ignore it and post it as it is I do this often, to see if there is a better way of saying something. If I do not, the post usually has some rough edges. Also I'm quite bad at speaking English, last I spoke at length was in highschool. I can manage interviews and such but not casual conversation, i take too long to hunt for words - this is obviously not a problem when typing or writing because you can edit it. There is no backspace key for the mouth.

>>8857 Its not tangential it totally on point

>>8852 That pics use of english is so bad, it makes me feel embarassed. That is the kind of english you hear those pretentious cool rich urban guys talk in english, like they just landed in from New York. And act superior when they talk fast with an accent. They also repeat the same 3 phrases - "I was saying like, what do mean like, " "Literally" "O My GOD, that is sooooo good" and adding "na" at the end of sentences.

>>8864 >Chinese room huh nice read, themks

I usually listen to podcasts and long videos and noticed that they help me with spoken and written english respectively. Podcasts have a natural tone and hearing them gets my brain turning in background. But only the funny ones, not the pseudo intellectual ones. Long videos have more structured feel and best if its educational and documentary.

>>8908 Is there any indian podcast worth listening?

>>8916 Not that I'm aware of

>>8852 The 3rd one sounds like he's directly trying to use causal way of speaking English while writing. While speaking, intonations helps in skipping some words from the sentence as they are obvious. Tbh I do the same thing, that's why I can get into his thought process of commenting.

>>8666 This thread has grown into a great thread. Points to keep in mind. 1. Language is a tool, a tool has a purpose. 2. The purpose dictates the need of the tool i.e. language in this case. I am fluent in multiple languages 1. English and German are used professionally so I keep them for that. My sentences are formal, my tone is diplomatic and never express too much emotion. My vocabulary is scientific not expressive. 2. Hindi and a regional language is a language of thinking for me and personal interactions. But I don't like the Hinglish/whordu devolution. So I speak relatively pure in both. Vocabulary is expressive not technical. 3. All other languages are need to know only. Enough french to order in a restaurant and read basics. Enough Italian to not order beef. Etc. >>8853 This is gold because most anons don't do this. Sure, you can reply "Iski mummy sleeveless blouse pehenti hai" or "Teri ma randy" etc. But if its a well thought reply, you wish to communicate with fellow anon, then - Take time to read . Read once and understand the points the anon makes. - Note your down points in response - Refine the language - Type it out. Check for errors or grammar. - Attach a related image if you feel it adds to the feel of your post or is relevent- - Hit send. This is better than creating walls of pointless meaningless responses, which is what most threads on Indian chans become.

>>8857 What you are saying refers to one finding their style. Each of us has idiosyncrasies. Spelling and grammar beyond the basics , the "mistakes" we make, are our style. Writing in Word style processors hurts us. It gives suggestions that makes everyones ideas seem the same. This is why I use pen paper or text editor without spell and grammar check like vim. Good post.

Sadly I have met midwits from elite families. This stacy girl, from a multi crorepati family speaks and talks like a proper retard. >>8864 If you don't need to speak the language regularly, then this is fine. The chinese room is how it feels speaking to many people. >>8908 >>8916 Abhijit Chavda's last episode was pretty with the french intelligence guy. >>8852 The images in your post are painful to read.